David Lance Callahan interview – “I could say what I’m saying in any genre, but I’d rather invent my own”

We head Down To The Marshes with the English primitive and “Legend of Indie” – or is it Myth?

“But surely that’s more Krautrock?”

Stewart Lee, almost certainly the funniest man in Britain right now, is relating his argument with the evangelical Christian who rang his doorbell in 1989, demanding to know “if Jesus is the answer, what is the question?”

Lee claims it’s his only proper joke and it’s one that usually rears its hilarious head in his set in one form or another.  Tonight, upstairs at the Lexington in North London, it’s developed to the point  where the Christian begins to question the wisdom of using his speculative answers – which reference 90s cult grunge stars The Jesus Lizard and the ‘Jesus boot’, the 70s slang for sandal – should Lee ever decide to use said references in his material in, say, a support slot at a gig in 2024.

“That’s where you’re wrong,” counters Lee to his imaginary critic, pointing at that as tonight’s headliner David Lance Callahan has now moved on from the sampladelia and Krautrock influences of his former band Moonshake, and into the realms of new English folk, the likelihood of quite a few sandal wearers in the audience was rather high.

The truth is, there is no evidence of sandals among the sold out crowd for the latest in a series of Legends of Indie nights staged by the comedian, featuring a selection of his favourite acts and also including a typically hilarious  work in progress set from the man himself.  Cunningly disguising – as he often does – his act of finely honed material as a deteriorating banter session with the crowd, he has us in stitches.

Having declared his supposed frustration at how wrong he thinks it’s all going, as subjects like the evils of honey production, falafels and ancient stone circles come under the discursive microscope, he rounds off his set by pointing at a punter near the front, saying “you’ve been to all of these, haven’t you?  That was the best one, wasn’t it?”

It’s a very conscious throwback to the days of the 80s when comedians and poets would support punk bands – Lee himself cites seeing Ted Chippington opening up for The Fall as a major impetus for starting his career. 

“I’ve certainly had some unintentionally funny bands opening for me in the past,” Callahan admits, when we get to question him a week or so after the event, “but I was slightly too young to have asked Ted Chippington first time around. It’s good to have a disciple of the master support us (in all senses of the word). I think my crowd is mature enough to cope with anything the bill throws at them. They might have to be in future!”

Callahan, whose career started with the guitar-led pop crew The Wolfhounds, plays a stripped down but powerful set based around his latest, third solo album Down To The Marshes, accompanied in the main by only a drummer.  How does he feel being described as a ‘Legend of Indie’?

“I’m more of a ‘myth of indie’, especially as I couldn’t really be said to be playing any kind of generic indie music. Independent, yes. The Lexington was exciting, partly because we managed to sell most of the tickets before Stew was announced, partly because we tried out a couple of new songs for the first time and partly because playing a gig is always a blast for me and Daren. I knew Stew had said the English Primitive LPs were his favourites of the year, so yes, I was aware. High praise, as he has good taste – and I like a lot of his standup material too.”

We catch him at the end of a day spent signing 250 lyric booklets for the new LP with individually different messages to make sure each is unique.  After cooking a katsu curry for his partner and daughter, he’s out to see the reformed AR Kane at the Jazz Café close to Juno Daily’s HQ in Camden, North London.

He’s just returned from Berlin where he played with the reformed Swell Maps C21 – he’s off to Bologna with them soon, too, after a few dates up north – all in support of Down To The Marshes.

Where does the album’s title come from?  “It’s modelled on the Lea Valley Park, where I spent a lot of time walking during lockdown. I looked at all the other cross-generational people wandering and running around and started to think of their lives as seasons, and out sprang the song. It seemed like the best one for the LP title, as my main themes are town versus country, history versus now and animal versus human. But hopefully you can dance to it too.”

Callahan’s interest in nature and in particular birdwatching – he also writes professionally on the subject – plays a part in the album’s lyrics, most obviously the celebratory, brass-fuelled ‘Robin Reliant’.   Has that been a lifelong fascination? 

“It’s been a lifelong hobby/fascination but only part of my living for the last decade or so. I’ve always been a nature boy at heart, though.”

Has he seen (orange Juice vocalist) Edwyn Collins’ drawings of birds, that were part of his post-stroke therapy?

“Edwyn C’s drawings are lovely (Vic Reeves also does something similar). But I lean more towards the Billy Fury end of birdwatching, and use it as an excuse to travel and get into unusual scrapes and situations – again, inspiration for songs, much more than music itself. “

After English Primitive Parts 1 and 2  – his first two solo efforts – this is another very English-themed album. So what differentiates it from the other two enough to need another name – and will till there ever be an English Primitive 3?

“Well, you’ve always got to press ‘refresh’ haven’t you? I have no intention of doing an EP3, but these days my music is always influenced more by my surroundings than anything I’ve listened to recently. I’ve adapted to my habitat like any good primate should.

It’s a very English record, as we say, but it’s recorded in Valencia, Spain…

“My label is based in Valencia and there was a great but cheap studio there, with excellent musicians from the Berklee School keen to get an esoteric record on their CVs. But I normally have an idea what I want the record to sound like before I even walk in the console room. So, other than the guided input of the musicians themselves, which was fantastic, it could almost have been recorded anywhere, although the regional food was excellent.”

The folk tag is partly accurate, partly misleading.   Callahan’s guitar sound is very much electric, gloriously jagged as ever.  But there are distant echoes of folk traditions on the LP in terms of its often economic composition and especially lyrically, tracks like ‘Refugee Blues’ – a reimagining of WH Auden poem from 1939, yet never more relevant – or ‘Father Thames And Mother London’.

It certainly sounds like a far cry from The Wolfhounds and Moonshake, which managed to turn guitar music on its head with their organic fusion of electronica and rock, but his distinctive and highly recognisable songwriting remains at its core.  

“I’ve always admired the way The Beatles and David Bowie changed their music for every LP,” he says, when we ask him about the three very different musical flavours of his career, “so that must have seeped in early. But I just have a restless soul. There’s the same seam leaking through all my music, especially thematically in the lyrics. I sometimes think I could say what I’m saying in any genre, but I’d rather invent my own. Expect a Tommy Dorsey swing LP or a DLC in dub at some point, perhaps. Combined even.”

Ben Willmott

To buy Down To The Marshes on vinyl or pre-order the CD, click here